8 Comments


  1. If Matt is the only one who knows then it doesn’t give a good impression on the whole WP organization.
    The way Jane, Aaron, Peter (westi), Otto, Mark Jaqtuith speaks of it it looks like its set in stone. No more input they have a group and thats it (Well there is this http://wpdevel.wordpress.com/2010/01/11/core-plugin-infrastructure/) . At least from my perspective.
    The lack of understanding to other ideas are also concerning. There also seem to be some hybris going on regarding coding capabilities of core devs and those who are not core devs.

    When checking wp-hackers list the only two really delving into the matter is Mike Schinkell and Jeremy Clarkson I think. And that was months ago. Not easy to find and follow discussions in wp-hackers I think.

    From what I can gather it was all discussed and decided on WordCamp NYC in November.
    Aaron says hes followed the discussion on various lists and places. I have had a hard trouble finding these discussions. I’ve posted what I’ve found in the wp tavern forum http://www.wptavern.com/forum/plugins-hacks/1192-proposal-core-compnents-plugins-4.html#post10998
    If the discussion took place and the decision was made on a wordcamp then it aint exactly public and easily accessible to the rest of us.

    Discussions and decisions seems to take place in A LOT of different places.
    Why not figure out a way to tag stuff so everything regardless of source is shown on the same place? So we mere mortals and none core devs can follow whats going on and how the conclusions are made. And perhaps contribute in a more timely manner.


  2. Although I agree with you Andreas that it doesn’t give a good impression on the whole WP organization not speaking with one voice regarding this issue, I think the good part in Matt´s response is that he/they clearly do listen in and are responsive.

    Btw, maybe a somewhat naive question/viewpoint, but isn´t Akismet sort of already what these core plugins are intended to be? (I admit not being fully up to speed with all discussions on this topic).

    Why not figure out a way to tag stuff so everything regardless of source is shown on the same place?

    “Covering all of Internet” hashtags would be nice… If someone would have a go at that, I have a good domain name. :)

  3. Carl Hancock

    Akismet is not and will not be a core plugin. Akismet is a commercial product offering that is owned and supported by Automattic.

    An anti-spam plugin that is compatible with Akismet may be introduced as a core plugin, but it won’t be the existing Akismet plugin.


  4. Discussions and decisions seems to take place in A LOT of different places.
    Why not figure out a way to tag stuff so everything regardless of source is shown on the same place? So we mere mortals and none core devs can follow whats going on and how the conclusions are made. And perhaps contribute in a more timely manner.

    This is one of my biggest complaints regarding the WordPress environment. It hearkens back to my feelings that the organizational structure of the project is like spaghetti. I’ve got my hopes up that a revamped WordPress.org will help alleviate the multiple discussion area approach but I’m not sure it will. People have different methods of communicating effectively. We have the forum, the WP.Devel site, IRC chats, mailing lists, in person at wordcamps, emails, etc. None of these forms of communication are used solely for engaging user feedback and decision making.

    I first heard mentions of canonical plugins back in June of 2009 at WordCamp Chicago but had no idea what they were. I then heard about them again in more detail at WordCamp NYC where I thought the idea sounded good in theory. Then there was the post about the Canonical plugin idea with a poll on what to name these plugins on the dev blog. I don’t recall a special dev meeting to talk about canonical plugins other than the topic being brought up a few different times at developer chats. I think the whole idea was discussed a little bit on the WP Devel site.

    I understand WordPress is a big project with multiple facets trying to work together like a well oiled machine but I can’t help but wish that decisions or experiments related to the project were all done in a coordinated fashion with some sort of structure instead of wherever the decision or thought process happens.


  5. @Lars Tong Strömberg – Hehe. Tagging internet. It sounds more complex than I intended. But some sort of archiving or grouping I think needs to exist. Theres to much confusion all the time and a lack of transparency.


  6. @Andreas Nurbo – “From what I can gather it was all discussed and decided on WordCamp NYC in November.”

    Nope. It was a brainstorming session at WordCamp NYC, not any kind of official decision making. No decisions were made until the last couple of dev chats, and we’re still figuring things out.

    To Jeffr0′s comment: *everything* in WordPress is an experiement. :)


  7. @Andreas Nurbo – I’m flattered to be included in that list, but haven’t you worked this out yet? I have no real connection to any of those people. Never met ‘em.

    Hell, I’m basically just making this shit up as I go along here. :)

    So if you take anything I say without a heaping bowl of salt, then you’re making a serious mistake. I’m just stating what I think, that’s all. I have no idea what other people think unless they have posted it online and I read it. I’m generally pretty good at reading between the lines, but other than that, I know about as much as you do. There’s no inside info here.


  8. @Jane Wells – I checked the IRC logs and I posted the mentions of core/canonical plugins in the wp tavern thread and the most mentions was dec 10 and that is after your post on Canonical Plugin on dec 8. In wp-hackers maillist the discussions took place after your post also. Discussions before that didn’t have much in common with the path now taken.
    If the name was decided on Nov 14-15 then the phrase “core plugins” should show up somewhere between nov 15 and dec 8. Could question why even put out a poll if the decission was already made.

    There are mentions of canonical plugins here and there. No one really talks about it in the way its now presented it is discussed as something that is an addition to core or moving stuff out of core. Also some talk of APIs. Can’t really call it discussions at all. Can’t really find any discussion other than those I’ve listed in my wp tavern post.
    Canonical plugins mentioned are buddypress and bbpress.
    I’ve found this from july its the first mention of Canonical Plugins. There is no explanation of canonical plugins in the post that announced the poll.

    Clearly this issue deserves more discussion, and the concept of how we move toward a system of canonical plugins and/or core “packages” intended for different use cases (CMS, photoblog, portfolio, etc) will be a big topic in the months ahead.

    2.9 Features Vote Results
    So where can I find the discussions if they are no where to be found on the official list etc?

    @Otto – I know. It was late.

    WP.org should get Mark J too be the one to post public stuff and discuss. He seems to actually listens. At least his last comment in the Jay gives that impressions. And he was coolheaded in the whole privacy debacle also.

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